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Patrician Podcast Episode 14: Mental Health

Patrician Podcast Episode 14: Mental Health



hey everybody this is argent and we're doing episode 12 of the patrician podcast I just like to wish everyone a happy easter um I personally actually went to UM after work thursday i went to a saint michael's cathedral in downtown toronto which was nice there is actual latin for once which is kind of cool but it's under major innovations so kind of threw off the acoustics anyways um so let's see here we are going to do today we're going to cover mental health um so we'll probably just talk about mental health in general I think we'll probably at some point kind of get into what what just kind of relationship we think there is to create mental health and politics probably especially kind of like our kind of edgy community maybe also a bit about like Millennials and mental health I kind of give some of our opinions on is psychic is like overdiagnosis medications I just kind of a general discussion if someone here thinks that you could really add to this discussion I just post in the chat we could probably have one or two other people um but yeah that's just kind of the introduction would either of a dubby or is Naga would you like to make kind of an opening statement of some description um as for mental illness in general I've studied it somewhat just in school and everything I guess I know more about schizophrenia and depression and anxiety and other disorders of like the more schizoid antisocial and the border Erica's or even bipolar but I think but these are interesting you are talk about economies on one hand there's the biological coral annette 'ok on coral it's that we can discuss and also the behave yourselves you know what's-what's aberrant in people if these disorders and also the environmental factors and a lot of people all y'all ready to try to attribute everything genetics and all that but there are especially mental illness or clear environmental factors involved and then margit's that you said you wanted to talk about politics a little bit I feel like uh again it's kind of it's not it's it might not be the best case if you're trying to say that you're trying to attribute political views the mental disorders it's kind of more silencing tactic oh they only think oh no I'm just kind of interested if just just just kind of from a personal experience but I think I think they're there probably is a lot of mental depressed and Asus and mentally help people and they all right I think those war in the conversation and with terrorism I don't think there's really much research on whether I think a lot of it maybe maybe depressing but also just like feeling alienated from society is why a lot of people Western nations turn to terrorism by the parents tend to be upper or middle class mm-hmm the one thing once you successfully carry out the acts are they're the ones you typically have the most above ground connections and can organizing it the most things done and coordinate strategies and plans but the ones who do kind of the grunt work little peons a lot of them typically are disgruntled frustrated with with uh with their general lot in life and this is especially the case in like Saudi Arabia or unemployment typically very high or they don't obtain the jobs that they think they're entitled to right no I guess I mean more like I think it's undeniable that a lot if not like a plurality of people in kind of our sphere suffer from some sort of depression um and I don't necessarily think that depression anxiety causes anyone to go to the all right i think it's just kind of that causes that influences people or compels them to kind of just brood over the internet all day and gravitate toward kind of their own little world on the internet and it's not just like this for all right people is probably like this for a social justice warrior crowds and other left-wing types well and that's what I I've said a couple times I think if you did a psych test the profile is pretty similar between the two I think it's it's disaffected Millennials largely who tend to come from upper or middle class upper middle class or middle-class backgrounds who just says who kind of realized instinctively something's wrong with modern society they just going to take different paths to UM deal with it well that's a that's a major symptom of major depressive disorder is to what is it called the depression trifecta or the triangular depression something there's some kind of term I think Jonathan Hyde has listened is happiness hypothesis where it says that the trifecta is I have no self value I have no sense of self-worth the the world around me is bleak and there's a really sort of bleak and grim kind of future right and I guess I say it because I understand what you're saying Debbie and I agree with you but you do have to if just for sake of keeping yourself honest wonder how much of kind of the doom and gloom comes from the fact that there's such a high proportion of depressed people um or did the orders the depression come from the damn thing you know um with the press and at what is it like 20 30 or seven people have like some kind of oppression episode in their lives ya know what's a much smaller percentage the population actually on you all right that's why I'm causality it's kind of hard to determine because you'd say oh people are all right because of the press well there are so many to press people yet they're not all right but also in the other hand there are a lot of the all right people I'll say they're all represented in depression yeah I was kind of my point like I'm not saying it's causal I just saying I just think it's interesting and there's probably some kind of relationship of interdependence where depressed people kind of gravitate toward more bleak outlooks not necessarily all right but there's many other kinds of pessimistic outlets that anyone could take and then that will tend to reinforce sort of a depressed symptom and then kind of bear yourself even deeper um if I can ask if either you you don't have to answer have either if you ever suffered from some sort of mental health issues um I don't know I guess I'm social annoy just not really general Ike generalized anxiety disorder but uh I hit be pretty anxious and large group settings like Greg or just unlike in a big of even like I in Iraq in school like I will get anxious to read like lunchtime because I've been like having to find people sit with and having a partner up with other people's never particularly fond of um depressing yeah I guess depressive episodes but not like long-term different cities okay I had a major depressive bout that probably manifested when I was about 14 glass to tell I was about 17 and a half 18 is it not purely a common for teenagers just because of like hormones and shit like that not only that I've also seen some research that's just that one of the enzymes that converts one of the prostaglandin precursors into a prostaglandin e1 class that tends to be down-regulated after puberty so it so while prostaglandins can be they can have hormonal type of fedex so yeah kind of after puberty and a lot of different there's various biological shifts that occur I'm just gonna be blunt say I just find teenagers are fucking crazy in general um I kind of like even when I like turn 20 and now I'm not in my like mid 20s I feel like a lot of just kind of the irrational rage and just kind of um that kind of stuff has really kind of mellowed out over time okay I think I probably still get some of that rage no no I do too but it's it's it's mellowed a bit over time um part of it especially if you're like a teenage male is you're just frankly so horny all the time you're just angry oh I think that I think I might have had that except I was going through I was going through severe depression so that may have been kind of like a protective mechanism as if I had really gone when I was prescribed zoloft that one on that and I was like you know borderline kind of add up to a lot of deviant sort of borderline criminal behavior so the pressure may have been a protective kind of a last resort sort of thing well and that's the thing and that's kind of what makes um why bipolar has such a high suicide rate um because we get something where you're manic and depressive at the same time it's called a mixed State so you're you're like hyper high-energy kind of make lemon I achill but you're also extremely dis phoric and that combination is really dangerous there's kind of the thing with depression is you're just too lazy to kill yourself Oh like like to be honest like you just don't even want to be bothered yeah when I got but if you're like super high-energy like make a little banaya coal that tends to be like the most dangerous time okay so you not only have the gumption you have the enthusiasm and the motivation to carry out this kind of act yeah I mean back when I am because what I used to take was something called effects or which is literally like the strongest shit known to man I think it's the strongest antidepressant in existence I'm just is stuff kind of funny side note the original version had a four hour half-life arm and it has the worst withdrawal of any psychiatric drug so but when I took it I used to like have no early visions but just like the desire to just burn shit like I just used to be like constantly angry and just be like burn the world burn the world that kind of thing when I was on um but uh yeah so eventually for me they kind of figure it out cuz antidepressants work for me for a while and then they just stop um and I think what they kind of figured out was they trigger like a like a hypomanic phase but big empty depressants don't really work long term for someone by polar I need a mood stabilizer mmm is it because you eventually go through a belt of mania or hypomania um yes a lot of things trigger that plus the depression is kind of different than normal depression because I do take a antidepressant addition to my mood stabilizer but often what it does if taken by itself is you rapid cycle so as opposed to switching moods every three months you switch every week or every other week and it gets more intense but like once I started taking a mood stabilizer it actually dramatically improved my condition like a hundred percent um like now my depressive days last appearance last a bit like three days and they're much more mild um but anyways um yeah I what do you guys you guys let's just get back on topic do you guys think there's a massive problem with over diagnosing mental illness well I feel like if the frozen like you know if you like SSRIs doorknob they're not that bad like they don't don't really have very harsh side effects so even if you're feeling kinda down but I don't know that wasn't my experience with zoloft that was I I did not react very well with that so often I don't think you're reacting off the medicine what I mean like I feel like you're feeling like like I don't think there's a clear cut off between like between being depressed and just feeling sad like that's kind of I think it's more like a TD where you going out depression is like a sort of numbness you aren't even really able to kind of a be attached emotionally with other people you're just really you're really loud it really flat line you know severe depression where is like moderate depression yeah I mean it depends on what took you can eight and I mean if you could see if you if you can let's say you cake are looking a depression scale tests and its objective of you it's just a questionnaire and you don't use for like mid rains where it's kind of bored or no but it's kind of borderline then you take the antidepressants and you improve it's not like a real problem basically to from antidepressants stayed out they're not they're not like abusive unlike you know thet amines which is prescribed for EDD which is why does a lot more like talked about like Dom over prescription of like you know EDD and all that because that's a much more parce serious strong then SSRIs ok guys I see what you're saying like the risks of dependency or much lower and potential for other kind of medical hazards they're less not really abused SSRIs at least that I know like like I know people who use them recreationally but compared to how could he use SSRIs rep relationally when they take a while to set in I'm not exactly one that's really used is wellbutrin um which is the most similar to like methamphetamine or yeah I don't know all right well there's a phone because it also like effects dopamine I'll transportation believe yeah I tend to agree if you w I guess this is kind of my view of medication um it's it's part of treatment but I think it's very important because the problem with a lot of depressed people is they have such immense lethargy and such little motivation they really need something to pick them up and like get them like to have some energy so they can go do stuff to improve their lives uh-huh all right guys just getting dressed and you know driving to doctors appointment that feels like yeah like I guess like you know the severe severe depression like it's as basically you don't you don't see any reason to do anything you can't even get out of bed okay can know you can see the reason you just don't feel like it's ever justified for all the i/o you see the reason yet yeah you're right I like going to therapy or like going to your job or going to school or just because I find personally like when I'm employed it actually really does improve my mental state like having a routine that kind of thing and it's hard to do that when you feel like blowing your brains out and you can't get out of bed so I kind of think that's to me um one of the main uses and why i don't really i kind of take daddy's perspective we're like the problem with SSRIs is really the only major bad side effect is weight gain for some of them immaculate will actually weight loss in really severely inhibit in my appetite has a lot of his mana cost and it caused a lot of insomnia I couldn't go to sleep for I may have gone like 30 minutes of sleep a night for a little while and temperature regulation really jacked up my temperature regulation my skin would really hot it's really I was shivering okay so how long were you taking it for I think the longest i consistently took it for was about four to six months and then I was just like I'm not doing this anymore this is not this is not a viable solution plus i graduated early from high school and then I didn't feel the need to take it anymore le son on a consistent basis yeah um it's kind of like with SSRIs it's so so ciated with minor weight gain but a lot of that could just be like you should have liked more energy to eat like you feel like more motive I feel like if you're severely depressed like even like eating a meal could seem kind of like pointless to you so I wouldn't be all over in Shea but it literally does feel if you're super depressing start doing something that the colors have come back on and you start to enjoy things again also you actually enjoying food again yeah so you like in July cause you just were like you could have had like a really great like a delicious steak or something just be like us hey like wait inside of that your mind Oh five percents be there like it it depends though like the other thing is an issue something I found his people i just don't think interact with their doctors enough um so like I I'm 46 I have a really good relationship with my doctor so like if I have trouble with something I'll go talk to him I think a lot of people just don't really mention it I mean there's some that are like sip relax which are pretty mild and our kind of weight neutral um and that sort of thing but um oh but I i I'd I know there were studies like that i I just I don't know if I you can believe it it could just bend that the people love you select a telegram was a so state of like higher ratings like five percent or something or seven percent well that's also a bore efficacious um antidepressant which was me sone in sunny so just may have been like I don't really know if it's the drug that's causing like a metabolic I don't think it's like basically question is at metabolic or is it behave Oriole I think it's there's no clear no it has it been demonstrated and it's like a real doesn't affect hunger and satiety and the metabolism and so forth or does it just affect kind of a degree about going us so you get more festive and you enjoy things more oh but with organs case that it is pretty common to see people with bipolar to get really bloated on either antidepressants or bipolar medication I actually i did a video on this it's actually a symptom of bipolar to have an extreme almost violent craving for carbohydrates mmhmm yeah yeah I saw the video and looked a little bit into the gym it I've looked some into the biology it affects neuropeptide wall by which sort of mediates the reward system and then I think why president in carbohydrates all right no in bipolar if it people affected by bipolar they typically gain a much more pronounced response much more pronounced hedonic response and then that kind of sends a dance from cascade of increased a level of glucocorticoids which tends to elevate blood sugar levels and then it also increases I think it's glycogenolysis no neuro I think glycogen synthesis in the liver I pennington we'll look it up all right my understanding was it going to briefly stabilize some of the symptoms particularly in depressive phases I was also um risk is afren ian cigarettes you have that and i think like something about like the nicotinic receptors of sita choline um it isn't picnic tina mild antidepressant well you this nicotine it affects like nicotine is basically it stimulates the acetylcholine receptor Danny a nerd yeah yes I'll be so and I think not you see the calling the NMDA glutamate receptor and that you know call me that's it yeah that's a sympathetic nervous system agonist so you know Firefly t.o the quality is called the lucky n mvi you over some like an mva something like that where's basically it stimulated by nicotine Oh looking good yeah but like it's actually interesting i wonder if they could ever make coming the inversion of nicotine because it has a lot of kind of beneficial qualities to it nikka clinical stuff yet like it's a hunger suppressant it is an antidepressant antianxiety and it's kind of a stimulant now there are it's not really a class of drugs they're called nootropics are they simulate the ampa kind receptors in the brain so that causes an increased secretion of acetylcholine so you know it brings kind of a firing off Neuros neural signals more quickly and it's also more receptive to those signals and it tends to have some antidepressant effects and anxiolytics effects in people who have depression and anxiety so that right oh and it kind of has like mild and feta mean effects but it's a different actually um so based on nicotine it's not it is the acetylcholine nicotinic acetylcholine receptors but they act on the ventral tegmental area in the mesolimbic pathway it's basically that's just a reads in the brain that's active when you have rewards so when you feel good you have like you danik pleasure that's gonna be active so dope so actually so Nick scene actually makes you feel good but then there's also like a link between nicotine and schizophrenia right because if you have um what is this gets a friend you're too much dopamine oh that's like one of the no I think it's too little like it's kind of weird schizophrenic so have I think decreased levels dopamine yeah so what that's the activate the ventral tegmental area there's a lot of dopamine so it actually lose the symptoms if you look at the smoking rate for people's for any other oh that's right yeah l-dopa is convert is easily converted back into dopamine that can alleviate symptoms of I think schizophrenia as well as Parkinson's okay I'll give me the central topic of is there um because I've been having trouble finding definitive evidence is there a link between mental illness and IQ I know it depends on the mental illness so I think ocb and bipolar tend to be linked with higher IQs whereas schizophrenias linked with lower IQs I have no idea about schizophrenia I figured that it would actually be higher among individuals and lower IQs because it looks good yeah it's pretty his later to believe with lower IQs because I've heard that schizophrenia is so consistently distributed throughout populations whether they're like Kalahari Bushmen or anyone Eskimos there's pretty similar distribution is it much higher in blacks i'm not sure that i really don't know anecdotally it's hiring blacks well that's just that's really not that much to go on I've heard it hypothesize that no it's just I do I just find whenever I'm like in a major city there's always a bunch of like schizophrenic blacks running around but they could just be on crack so it's hardly the same kind of bond between bipolar and high intelligence yeah there is um partially just because when you're manic you're like it's almost like a superpower um like I used to be when i do my essays i basically write an entire essay in like one night like I have all the research done and I just wait for a um I don't I guess a manic died and i just stay I just work like 12 hours straight and just write the whole thing in one go out when you were in college or see ya hi folks I'm barn with a quick kitchen tip if you want more rise over it look at headphones yeah yeah but um I think OCD is also linked to high IQ uh which one makes sense to me um because it which is actually like sick of some theories I don't know how cracked like how accurate there with some series think uh certain things like anxiety disorders are linked to high IQ because they're um I kind of I know it's almost a kind of almost felt like a leadership cast thing and kind of like with introversion and some stuff like that uh that they're kind of ah they've evolved to fulfill like certain place in society I don't have it in front of me unfortunately that sounds really speculative to me mm-hmm OCD yeah I bet a lot of people in this community have some form of OCD I used to think that I had OCD actually for a long time um Jessica so she is kind of similar duh cuz I don't get full mania ox I'm uh type 2 but I do get a hypomania and it's it's kind of similar to OCD um gonna have obsessive behaviour but not necessarily OCD yeah um like I've never really been a neat freak but um I remember when I the one time in like the last 10 years I've been completely off medication I I got the feeling that everything around me was dirty um and that it was like contam it wasn't it wasn't actually physical it was like mental contamination but everything around me was like entering into my mind I'd like damaging it I guess you could say it making it kind of unclean um could be related to anxiety or something like that yeah it's like severe anxiety cuz i've been known obviously OCD people are going to get really anxious if they don't fulfill the rituals but that's distinct from general anxiety disorder yeah so happened I was like OCD they're gonna be a lot of people very high achieving people or OCD because you have to get the assignment on you have the study for the exam you have to do this you have to do that you have to be loved above all you have to study every day and that results in you know very high grades and very being very you know high achievers people just kind of relax and you know have a beer kind of weight to the day before a deadline they might be happier but there'll be less high achieving I don't know I that I think I deliberately tried to induce either OCD you're kind of a workaholic behavior with studying but I just burn out really fast so I kind of have to designate times where I just chill out and guilt-free it for it to be sustainable so I don't know maybe maybe that's true de would fit with OCD now someone had asked earlier how do we describe a mental illness in psychiatry in general so this is kind of my view of psychiatry I think it's all based around the idea of making people functional um functional in the sense that they're able to live what's it's generally societally considered a normal life with the minimum amount of I guess discomfort and etc so like I mean when it comes down like I guess that's kind of how you measure success like is the person able to I kind of go back and live like a productive life and that's interesting fun weirdest thing you know think you've just brought up because like psychiatry like it relies on the idea of like norms like it's it's inherently normative like that you're sort of in behaviors and ways of being that are non-functional and that need to be treated like if you are like let's say you just stay in your house all day and you don't have any ambition they'll say you know that's wrong there's something wrong with you it's not just oh you're just a special snowflake whatever you just you like it's kind of funny was like kind of psychiatry and whole kind of like interval individualistic vu kind of law and it's often very solid very opposed well I mean it's not necessarily anything inherently wrong in a in a kind of moral or aesthetic sense with just being really set in tarian a physically lethargic as opposed to regularly exercising and so forth but almost not just that it's that they're kind of lethargic and incapable in all areas of their life but my let's just assume that somebody is just for the second kind of pointing out the whole impetus behind psychiatric intervention is that is that they're supposedly is kind of a physiological basis for these abnormalities such as in depression there's usually decreased metabolic activity in the hippocampus decreased levels of serotonin and dopamine and norepinephrine and so forth and then if this is associated with all these behaviors than these behaviors are just kind of symptoms and we need to address the underlying cause anyway and I think this is referred to as negative psychology or psychiatry were you're supposed to alleviate symptoms of pathology worse there's also positive psychology which is to improve functionality in general even people who exhibit no abnormalities right like there's a lot of people because I've done mindfulness and just kind of sharing some of the techniques with other people who are not even like the diagnose mental ill they're like oh that's very helpful just to UM think about things that way just for like normal stress it's our mindfulness meditation um not even meditation just kind of were thinking pattern type things but that kind of is like cognitive behavioral therapy yeah it is what it's yeah it's it's it's related to it but it so it's it's kind of like like I remember being in class and I just said like just some examples of like you know trying to look on the positive side a blah blah blah blah and like you know I think that is that is really helping this helps you have like I think moats like some people like if you're not disposed to depression like I feel like you don't need to need to like do these mental exercises because you're just automatically going to be leading more towards optimism but I guess like if you have more of a disposition towards pessimism and depression you know you really need to work to have these kind of you know mental eSports come up and I mean normally if you gonna have a a more healthy mental outlook um and this is kind of something that has always been helpful to me is because I have a very strong sense of rationality and I'm always aware that I'm crazy like when I am what like just what i'm having like come at us I thought well not really psychotic but just one of those like intensive hate burn the world things or I want to kill myself because it's hopeless I do consciously realize that it's it's it's irrational that it's just um this this thing I'm experiencing that's not really coming from within me if that makes sense it's like it's something I've been subject to and I think a lot of um what's helpful with therapy is a lot of cases is there's kind of a tendency to just completely would draw into yourself and not get any kind of um external validation set the right word but like just for some things um it's very helpful to hear someone say like maybe like in my case uh my cousin tried to kill my uncle and I brought it up at my therapy group but everyone's like dude that's just fucked that's like and it's it's nice because like a lot of the times you're just you think like you're the only person I think that's a big part of it is that there's a loneliness to it um and you think I'm the only person who has these fears I didn't like well with like feeling isolation and loneliness like especially if you just go out you always see people with other people you always see couples together we see people are having fun it could be very easy to think that you're like literally the only person who's like not he's not driving it's not functioning properly in the social setting but like you know having people to talk to about this stuff came by actually make you feel a lot more human like it's not it's not something like totally wrong fuses not normal but this is something that happens to people well stop a lot of people i think i think it's also like realizing on that to a certain extent um people are kind of full of shit I'm not necessarily a bad way but when they're in public they try to put their best foot forward and they're there they're very worried about what people think about them so they'll try to also pretty impolite to try to just kind of pass all your dirty laundry run as somebody else who's a complete stranger so just it really would be bizarre people behaved in such a way as to portray themselves and that would I know I'm just saying it's it's just the point is what you're going to realize that it's a very hard thing to do that the appearance of everyone around you it's not the reality um and I find it helpful to think maybe about people you know or more successfully in some way who have some problems like my uncle's are very wealthy men or will he was but he kind of lost all his money due to inability controls family but he's a very successful businessman but his family life is completely fucked and his daughter tried to kill him multiple times so I mean like on the surface he'd be this this very successful well-respected businessman but if you actually like peer inside him he's like a completely completely dead inside he's been beating down so i guess my thing is like that's kind of one of the functions of psychotherapy oh it is i kind of pull you out of this prison within your mind I just like another step add to that one of the benefits of psychology and psychotherapy is literally just to have somebody to talk to like like even like literally just have somebody who cares about your problems that have a genuine interest in you land is talking and have someone you could talk about you know your problems working your life with and he's kind of fought you keep inside has it has a therapeutic benefit like if you like it could just be like a close friend but maybe you don't have a close friend you could find and maybe you're not understanding they don't really have a genuine interest in you like actually going to a therapy session and as you know real ah benefits I remember he was there maybe with some people with like anxiety and depression they're really suspicious of other people are really uncomfortable with you know having these kinds of conversations to people who might actually be receptive but they just wouldn't give them the time day well they're also um it's somebody completely outside of your life like you won't see them in daily life they don't know anybody you know it's kind of a situation completely free from social pressures um I just on the topic though I actually really i find it hard it's very difficult but I actually really do enjoy going to confession because in a way it's a bit like going to see a psychiatrist and it's it's just it's at the end when the priest is like your sins are forgiven it's very it really lightens your conscious um alright okay so like the problem I don't know I don't go to confession or anything I just wanted a remark it or kind of ask is it kind of like you're given an opportunity for self-improvement as well as self-reflection yeah normally um it depends like how busy it is but sometimes I've gone and I've been like oh I have the flying issues I I got angry and I yelled up my mother I am I have ongoing issues with demons from the internet um action because everybody's wrong no no you know what I'm talking about uh but just as things like that and and the priest will be like um like one of the priests that I have this is often like I can tell you're you're trying hard to be a good person and you should just try to do this um and this and this and this and if you make any progress here it's a good thing uh and then he normally will give me a penance to do and the penance will just be normally like say um five Hail Marys and say the Lord's Prayer twice and then your sins are forgiven and this rust like a logical level on the idea that because there's a lot of guilt particularly with anxiety and depression you think you're a terrible person you think you've ruined the lives of everyone around you you often will like maybe something embarrassed you back really early on in your load you cannot get over it yeah you cannot get over I still think about it years later you still kind of relive that moment in your life yeah it's like it's in the past like who cares and then you like go see a preseason look you're forgiven from it okay that bactin I'm kind of going back to the question about the basis for psychiatry or whatever and definition of normality I would just kind of say you're brooding over a pass event that and you're emphasizing it to an extent that is way beyond its proportional value with the rest of what's going on in your life because it exhibits this in this criteria so you're kind of embarrassed or anxious about something in the past so I would consider that abnormal but I don't know it sounds kind of like with what you were describing with confession and the Hail Marys and so forth that's kind of that like ritualized contrition and no it's an act of contrition that's what it's called yes and steadily trying to self improve in development yes the priest normally says okay you should do this you should do this you should do this uh like like if they're kind of like if there is not too busy um then they'll bill spend a bit more time with you ah and they'll let me do it if they're like a good priest not kind of like a really like harmful trad who's just like you're going to hell you bastard ah is the who's humanistic and apathetic yeah I know just they'll just be like real with you they'll just be like look you came here you're obviously trying to like improve your life here are there any Irish ones are not around actually the priest I normally go to is Chinese um okay I want to cut them say they're all dumb diary of all search no it's the remark on that whole how you how you saying like it doesn't helps you like I but I think there's a good amount of evidence that religious people were beer and a less firm depressing and that's probably in part just has to do to like if you're religious you have that faith in God you have it's also the community aspect but just but I'm just kind of like interested in that in a kind of God aspect like having being able to talk to God have a relationship with God you know it puts you at peace that puts you put you at ease like like actually like having like that kind of connection where is if you're an atheist and you literally you know believe you know that there's nothing really out there and that you know if you do wrong and if you feel bad about yourself it's just totally on you there's no like greater being you consult to and who could who can redeem you well probably contributes to their army now what would be interesting for me is to see if you can compare atheists who have certain spiritual outlets like like if it's stoicism from like Marcus Aurelius or whatever or the more contemporary kind of jiddu krishnamurti sort of philosophical ideas and then they practice stuff like mindfulness meditation I'd also like to see like a study where you had atheists but they had like big communities so they were just as connected in their communities as the church goers and see if you still have that increase in the present i feel like right created the community but there's probably more to it but I don't really want to recognize because our secular okay so just uh I just could talk about this a little bit because this is a very big thing for me um when I when I really started because I was initially like I've always kind of believed in God but was I started kind of getting into Christianity when I found very helpful about it is a belief in God kind of encourages you to kind of take your head out of your ass I it's like look there's a bigger world there's these things of bigger significance you have responsibilities not only to other people but to God you have responsibility to conduct yourself a certain way um you have a responsibility um to your life because your life doesn't belong to it ultimately belongs to God so I kind of because I had been really against therapy I had been against armed kind of ignore looking at my own faults etc and once I kind of went through that I kind of realized that I kind of used my lot of kind of my anger particularly from kind of like manic depressive periods and just taking it out on everybody around me and just kind of done that and then once i'm like no i am i'm acting i'm acting badly and it's it's about i guess kind of God's definition of what's bad it's not about me me me me and there's that it also as I like to say it doesn't necessarily blood the pain of life but it does give you the strength to endure it arm it like i said it gives you a much kind of broader perspective of the universe um kind of to a certain extent knowing that you you don't matter is actually very liberating arm because like knowing that like for instance you have just billions of other people who make their own decisions and that the world is is not really in your hands but you can't really fuck up the universe that kind of thing it just I find really helps with a lot of the guilt issues I guess in that helping quite a bit with anybody with depression anxiety because the tendency is to just get inside your own head and then indulge yourself in a vicious cycle of you know negativity of all your inadequacies of all the shortcomings of people around you and just how like the rest of the world is so if you can get out your head get outside your head and their best to observe things as kind of soberly and objectively as you can then I also think that's a very interesting point you made our day about um about when you were secular you're more secular you didn't want to go to therapy because you didn't want to even want to really address your phone eltz because obviously people are naturally they don't want to hurt their self-esteem like it to say that you have a problem that you're not succeeding maybe you have a problem with food you have a problem with relationships you get you inger you drink too much or there's just you don't work hard enough you have attention issues you know it's going to hurt yourself inmates it doesn't feel good to recognize your faults but um and if you have a kind of yeah it looks like no enjoy your vulnerabilities and all your fears huh if you have a specular outlook you don't have any higher standard so you can kind of your kind of twist things around and say like oh well this is just who I am this is so it's totally okay to be be a blah blah blah blah I are just an asshole that's just who I am like there are people like I've known people at the end like oh I'm just like an asshole like it like they're just bad people they did three people wrong you're very like exclusive and have three people like Larry like not not consistent in your behavior like they're just kind of jerks when they because I don't and they're telling their always the atheists but if you have massive issues with misanthropy but I mean if you have like this higher standard to appeal feel like this higher god it's not just about you it's about it's about doing the right thing by God and it's not about doing the right thing and make sure you feel good about your about yourself about doing the things that don't need God proud of you know me it'll make life easier Malzahn's and that could actually you know spur you to go to therapy and chic self-help to better reach that ideal that's encoded in your religion well yeah I mean it's it's it's it's very useful to have basically someone hey look we're gonna we're going to love you we're going to help you we're going to not expect the world of you but you really have to try to do something like you really need to um I guess kind of reached out I'm sorry just sigh no it's not that do you have any spiritual beliefs I don't think I've ever asked you I'm atheist but I regularly do month less meditation I have certain philosophical influences yeah I figured that um I figured more or less we just hadn't confirmed it before now I can explain some of the things that I think might have some of the same effects as the kind of the doctrines of contrition from from Catholicism from Jiddu Krishnamurti it's it's very driven toward being eminently an entirely mindful of your surroundings in mm-hmm just maximizing your ability to perceive with you know the full capacity of your senses and it's a you're entirely immersed with your environment totally outside of your own mind and you forget about things such as comparing yourself to other people you don't so much care about comparing yourself to let's say coworkers or other students or anything tightly centered around and just kind of engaging the rest of the ball right I got the big part of it but other thing I think for me one of the most helpful things ever I discovered was just that realization that just because someone's like really good in one area does it mean that you're not better than them in another area like um I guess that's kind of where kind of some of the idea of money doesn't buy happiness comes from although in general I actually think money does normally buy happiness but um or at least it frees you from a lot of shit that would make you really on halfway you know it makes you comfortable you could have like obviously you don't want to be homeless like they have a nice place to have be able to afford food to be able to afford other things that be able to go out she shows and all that but it doesn't want to be able to afford an area which you know your family members or loved ones are not at risk for criminal tax or anything like that uh-huh but I mean like if you don't have like social relationships for pretty much everyone like you need social relationships to be happy they have people care about you and I care about other people so that so it money it could only get a look at you halfway there and let you still have to actually go out there and have like a functioning mindset and functioning you know behavior to really be have happy yeah but also liked it assuming you don't get your money through just working 70 hours a week if you have money and kind of take some more time to do that sort of thing well Han na healthy not like you're not you're not so stressed out with both you know paying your rent every month you can actually you actually be less you probably be more at ease with people with like you know you your peers and everything like I get you know people who are under a lot of stress I tend to not be it'll cannot make the best friends or whatever or been a partners because you know constantly worrying about that and they can't really respond to the most of the needs of the people they were interacting with as well and girls of people with depression and anxiety ironically know like I know when I was going through my kind of prolonged period of unemployment going to Mass every Saturday night was like one of the few I to schedule things I had it just would always is this was one of the something that was always there um and I just found that very helpful I was about it to the unemployment tends to leave the press and non-employment I don't think people realize how bad it is I I guess there's the neat culture that's trying it's always joke about uh you know how neat live like the best life and all that but it's like there's some studying like twenty five percent of meats and written after considered suicide and I don't want to mess with like you know of the needs and I know a lot of them just have very like unscheduled on you know life is about any kind of you know coordination or routine and like no routines will just kind of wake up at like 4pm and have breakfast and and shit post on the internet for a couple hours and it's just it's not a good way to live basically yeah people for whatever reason don't seem very inclined to be self-directed and structure their own lives they typically do need some kind of some degree of imposed structure whether that's that's what school does retell like you know why do you need school people should just be able to teach themselves fine okay that's I was a probably the exception of that school just about drove me to suicide above your like you're kind of a unique person that like her a minority personality and uh huh I that school was like a dog kennel for kids I was miserable I had no that's cuz i got ever for a gentleman she once said that like why do you need these public school systems you should just have like videotapes like you go you go in and you listen but he's he is autism so you like reporter you can't have like autistic people uh dictation autistic people are probably the ones to mean that kind of structure and regimentation the most if anything they need every team like 'bikery uh that is a really good point look about like work it gives you structure you like you have to go here and you have to work from nine to five and we're going to give you you actually hands like you have entire people whose job it is to just make the routines and schedules for other people like supervisors and all that who kind of me if you work like as a nurse you have somebody who has to work up all the ships and all that all that paperwork and designated obligations uh-huh tangible a feedback for if he did a good job if he didn't do a good job you know get Pat's on the back you get approval from co-workers and so on so yeah yeah just getting employment of any kind is probably going to the going going basic bitch concerned if you're from it I think like being able to just like pay your own way to say like this is my money I'm gonna like I'm paying my rent I'm paying my bills I can buy myself stuff and it's it's it's it's the result of kind of my effort in something I did I think that's very good for people's self-esteem now as I have criticized in the past a lot of things that I think could be made done to make work better I think a lot of people work too many hours the point that they don't enjoy life but in general I I do believe it's very good for you to be working um even if it's just like I'm I don't limit that just to school or just a paying job but just to have some regular in your life even if you like you're just a volunteer but if you but I think like you know you don't get that benefit of having that paycheck and having your work value being able to pay your own way but just it to have the routine and have that feedback that like kind of like you're doing a good job after a good job and just to have social interactions like when you're working most jobs like require you to interact with people like even if just your boss or your partner or something look you need you need to eat your you people talk to you people tell you like how was your day how's a weekend like one of these people don't really have social interaction so it needs because they do this because they don't yeah that they don't have that everyone's at work all day were they doing there and the worst part is probably most of their interaction is through the in component of human interaction it's also the bottom of the barrel of human interaction oh um says the guy who's on that talking to I mean I think we have like AI weiwei told us was that a dig at me yeah this being a little joke well like this I got personal experience but yeah like I feel like if you also like if you're unemployed you have nothing to do you're are more likely to probably seek out like people and druggies and games and all that likes actually you have like these towns of high and high black youth unemployment those tend to be in places will get a lot of games you have a lot of drugs because people were bored I want they want to be part of something even if they do not think there is it and immoral there's a difference between like taking a sabbatical or like if you're a teacher taking three months off in the summer and being unemployed because it's you still have like direction in your life ah it's also that buddy all the teachers like they don't just like sit at home for an onslaught them will work at a summer camp order tutor or when shaving their houses or or to have a family or something maybe they're just any time to okay even if you fewer teacher like a young teacher and you literally did nothing to three moms you probably would start to get the first petty end of it you told me I remember from school I remember during summer vacations when I was in camp I tend to be very happy all summer I hated way back to school but as soon as camp ended and I would literally do like nothing during my summer vacations I didn't have a license I couldn't work or anything I would just start it just gets so monotonous I was just like you know I need stimulation well that's kind of the thing with bipolar that's nice because if I have doubt I never really have downtime uh like during kind of my coded down time I will often like get through multiple books in a week or like watch like entire TV shows and like a day or two mommy all want entire TV so isn't like that but um you know just but it it feels kind of you know faceless kind of yeah that's just something fun II didn't working on any uh Jonathan Heights the happiness hypothesis 1 one thing that he remarked dawn is how important it is to have things that are kind of on a day-to-day week-to-week basis that consistently lead up to term goal and it's something that you chose of your own volition in using your own judgment is offered if you're just kind of meandering if it just kind of be under and then you know I ever going to get involved in either of those two no but I really feel like like like back in school I didn't like school I was not I was not an engaged student at all I would basically wait for the bell for the bell to ring out stare at the clock waiting for the bell to ring I never really paid attention and take notes I didn't I really didn't give a fuck but I didn't want to be there I didn't like the teachers I didn't like the way the whole system was right on and all that but i was still it was still good for b2b going to school five days a week and have now routine and add nine runs of univ oh if it was a really bad system and i wasn't doing well of it I wasn't doing well in that systems are socially or academically but I was ok acted I wasn't great but I wasn't living up to my potential basically it was still good to have that routine and more when I got a point to my life like I'm like you know summer before college where I was literally doing nothing after a while um that that got to be a lot worse than score ever got to me I don't think I ever really appreciated that like I think even if you're working with your shitty job you really have a lot of people like it might not even like their job but they're better off than if they were unemployed and it's actually if you take people who retire early in life this is a real thing you take people retire early in life they have higher a died earlier so they've increased mortality even though you know retirement is folks to be this great joyful thing like oh I'm retiring these are the best years of my life you know apparently not now also ended singlet semi-retired where they get stuff yeah i mean like okay or if you have like a like a hobby that you're actually spent a lot of time on like writing or painting or yeah my grandfather learned a lot about woodshop and guides and he's gotten really good since he retired even though he retarded like 62 so but he has such a strict regimented life so it doesn't suffer from the from deon we in the kind of malaise of unemployment or retirement my grandfather is well he's a German Mennonite so he is finally leaving his is three day a week job at the age of 86 um up till like two years ago I they used to have a wood stove in the house and he would go to cut wood every morning and fill up the wood stove and he would like make his own like stuff and do all these like construction projects he had like an acre of land that he cultivated and it's just kind of that that culture um were just basically if he's not working he thinks it's a waste of his time well be like some people may be like that but there are a lot of people arts and myself included where you give me a buff off like I just won't eventually I'll just stay in Matt I won't do anything at that time like but he got so much time to study I no buts like I'm not studying for a class it's like I don't see the motivation the real incident that's the joke I make with everybody takes a break or whatever i'm like 'oh spring break that kicks ass i got so much more time to study because you're wasting your time in fucking class uh-huh actually in the last Europe's of university I just stopped going to classes that didn't have attendance and my grades significantly increased in those classes yeah I feel like yeah like if there's a better use for your time you've ever thought better use of your time is just taking it but I actually feel like I just it's better for me to take a nap as long as all my classes well don't just sit there not pay attention is be bored for an hour and a half and I'm tired whereas I take a nap i was i won't be tired i could actually do work later well like I think for me it was um it was more that the tests and exams tended to be on the readings and not on in class content and the in class content was often like considered wrong answers at the end um so yeah a brilliant ah so that was so I just did the readings and didn't let go to class in it what a lot better um but no it's it's an interesting thing something I get triggered by his people and I get a lot of comments whenever I do a mental health video of people who just scream a mental illness doesn't exist um I really um you know captain capitalism Aaron Clary yeah yeah he made a video about how like he thinks that autism doesn't exist or he thinks that there's a number of oh yeah like bipolar and he said like even went so far as to say like 20 years ago we didn't have formal definitions for this and this didn't exist 20 years ago by a lot of people there's a lot of people who sympathize with that I shit you not know I'm gonna be honest I don't really care if I burn bridges I just don't like him Erin clearly does some good stuff I like some of his videos just on Millennials and booed baby boomers so this stuff on the economy he is an asshole um he calls himself at an asshole uh he is he is really misanthropic arm and just yeah well like well this is just patently false that pretty much his whole diatribe was you know he was making demonstrably false statements but he has this iron conviction and what he sang so I'm for whatever reason it seems like some people just want to believe like it's all in your head it but or you can you have complete control over your thought processes we know why it's an apparent it's because he's a libertarian and I found that's very common among hardcore libertarians because if they acknowledge that some people had like natural disadvantages or advantages that would kind of destroy their worldview it may be like rational self-interest theory or something like that but I don't know I'm kind of libertarian in a pragmatic sense not ideological no no I mean the people who think that if we had libertarianism everyone would be like an industrialist oh that's like this statism causes depression yeah idea that like and this is something they'll say in America like everybody if they just worked hard they would become wealthy they'd become the next bill Gates you can see this kind of stuff from conservatives as well you need a yourself up by your bootstraps and and you know stiff upper lip and that'll cure or that'll alleviate OCD or anxiety no I like there is a little true there is some truth to that it's just it leads to I think a lot of cases telling depressed people that their share and that they're like lazy and week doesn't is really unhelpful um like late because that was kind of my thing is it was I'd a lot of trouble kind of getting help because people just talk about telling me to suck it up yeah you're not come you're your reasons for complaining aren't valid and everybody else hasn't so much harder they aren't depressed they aren't whiny little bitches it I think I feel one of the main things it's not just you know the biological know you know neurotransmitter issues it's also the lack of social support and the lack of a job lack of routine and if you don't have and like once you're in that state it's hardly can have it actually lets you if you don't have a job you don't have references how are you going to um it's hard to get a job what's your like you know it's easier to get a new job what's your unemployment because you have this you know you're a worker you know you have all this references and everything but if you're let's exhausting employment making much more difficult to get a job yeah basically that but also we also say the same thing so silly like if you don't have friends and you don't belong to a social group it's really hard to find threads and join a social group and how many people total jobs their social circles uh-huh uh-huh and if you're in like a social group you tend to kind of course kind of what the parties are one not and meet up with people from other soldier groups or you have a friend in your social group and he's friends of other people and then you all get together and you meet for new friends and everything kind of expands but if you don't have anyone and you could just you know stay alone all the time so like it so the whole gonna pull yourself out for hit booth draft arguing it doesn't work you're probably in a bad you're in a bad state once you're in that state it's really hard to climb out of it yeah and this is only one c'mon kind of depression to it doesn't even address stuff like postpartum depression with an increase in prolactin how that tends to inhibit dopamine because dopamine tends to shut off you know milk production in in lactating women so you know there's another hormonal biological basis for a different kind of depression there's also depression from people who are chronically overworked and overstressed and under and not getting enough sleep that's a different kind of depression as well so sudden I I can I really don't want to go through the laundry list of why it's ridiculous to say that mood disorders and mental issues don't exist well okay here my kind of thought is okay if I don't have bipolar then why did bipolar medication so dramatically improve my mental state when like other ones haven't less able even though they're placebo double-blind placebo-controlled tests let's not get into that it was all in your head I don't I don't know how somebody wouldn't respond to that really well no I mean because like I've taken antidepressants before but I take my Moto G now and it's um it's just dramatically improved my standard of living so in a way that other drugs haven't arm and it's done exactly what it's supposed to do I understand lamictal actually has some very strong antidepressant features but it has actually stabilized like it's done its job like my mood is a lot more level I don't have as many ups and downs um so it's it's it's I kind of kind of my thing like if this was all an illusion then why does it work for so many people and I don't know point to it doesn't work for a lot of people but it works also works for a lot of people um now there is right i mean medicine for headaches and for stomach issues don't work for everybody because people respond to it differently because there's a biological basis for how people metabolize certain drugs right some people have to it's very common to have to go through several different psychiatric drugs we find it before you find one that work we're especially because diagnostics are difficult yeah cuz a lot of the stuff is very similar I like they didn't diagnose my bipolar for a long time so it's bipolar type 2 and I just get um uh yeah it's I get hypomania which is um it's it's very mild it actually feels very pleasant a lot of the time sometimes it is kind of anxiety and I get like hyper aggressive and just if I ever my kind of rage in the chat in like the sky proof that's normally when I'm going through like a hypomanic period but IE but in hypomania don't see shit like buying blowing all the money in your bank account are just kind of running to Lexus items and also extremist good gambling got all your money away all that uh-huh everything so maintain your judgment it doesn't totally disrupt your life yeah and then a lot of people find it very pleasant because it just kind of gives them more energy and they like feel really creative various difficulties in the five folder in creativity that's a real thing you know it is and um I find just in my experience as I was in um I don't know what they call it in America play I was in the gifted class um just something like that in the States yeah we have like on those programs and stuff like that no like I like they selected us out when we were in like grade 30 not really I don't think that a public schools systematically do that there's book there's one of my opportunities oh we do that in Ontario arm there's like a completely different system that gifted kids go to yeah be there if there are some gifted schools like I know there was a long island school for the gifted Cooper few you how to apply to it look at it wasn't like God it wasn't like a public school treaty for it you have actually we have a cases in Ontario everyone is evaluated often by a psychologist at the 8th grade 3 ought to try and identify learning people were going to stay hard and learning gift yes yeah so I actually died was diagnosed with both um because there because i had a post-secondary level uh vocabulary in grade 3 but sub kindergarten level arm drawing a bill of us motor skills so but no I'm I long about point was that um virtually all the people I knew in my program had some sort of like eccentricity arm be a depression be it likes kind of the kisum be it like OCD okay yeah geeks in kind of mental ticks or like a have you ever watched malcolm in the middle yeah okay with a with a crow boeing class the gifted class and how they had an outdoor picnic in they had to have it on the blacktop because half the class was allergic to grass and now but and there are all vegetarians and election no but like I finally just weird shit tends to be associated with high IQ arm just I found it like virtually all the people i was around had some sort of issue like that like it wasn't even always like they were dysfunctional or anything it's just some sort of anxiety disorder learning disability arm bizarre kind of personality trait just seemed to be associated with it so i don't know what my father both my father and his older brother went to a prestigious catholic private school in cuba and it it wasn't like an egghead kind of institution even though 54 Astra this is prior to the castro revolution and it was you know that the academic standards for hi but all the boys were encouraged to you know get involved in sports and stuff I think they were required to get involved in sports he couldn't just be yeah you know you couldn't just be kind of a bookworm you had to do a lot of other stuff I know Adam West Point that everyone has to participate in the sport ok that's a military academy so that yeah that makes sense it's gonna be a little more old school like that actually just sorry is the side note um I think it a lot of cases on or never mind no I actually went to West Point a last summer just if anyone has ever in that area of the country it's got a really interesting place to go see um so yeah we've covered a lot of different stuff um I is dogged you know anything about let me just look up what the method of action is for lamictal um you know much about neural chemicals I know some molecular biology about the brain and uh whatever like Northland or norepinephrine yeah norepinephrine deed yeah the catecholamines that's pretty spin the kidneys well that's not just the kidneys I think it's excellent all right well adrenaline or epinephrine is secreted by the adrenal cortex naveen isn't it also produced from the brain adrenaline yeah but but we're talking about norepinephrine I don't think that is synthesizing the Kings anyway this is more of a yeah this is going to simulate the sympathetic nervous system it's going to increase stuff like synaptic plasticity up-regulate nutrient absorption and stuff like that okay so here's what lamictal does sodium channel blocking which inhibits voltage-sensitive sodium channels ok so the voltage-gated channels that's how it creates I swear I don't know why I can't think well I can pencils yes AB that's it yeah yes I quickly on voltage is kind of like the difference in energy between the inside of the membrane and the outside of the membrane so if you have like a bunch of positive charge of a bunch of negative charts and they're separated they want to retract and nap it's called potential energy just like if you have something really high up it wants to go down and as a lot of potential energy and basically what happens is a cell worldly fire when the voltage is at a certain level and that voltage can change based on chemicals that are released and affect the receptors so when enough of those chemicals enough like the excitatory chemicals affect the cell and effector receptors that cell fired or have some kind of response be it like well it's just going to be one cell but that but all that poor of activity will cause stuff like movement and emotion and cognition and all of that it's all it's all basically a complex system yeah I'll also inhibits gaba I think ok GABA that's that's going to affect the parasympathetic nervous system so that can have kind of a calming effect yeah so that's probably why because I find it's really good for um anxiety ok yeah a lot of people actually take GABA for yes as a sleep remedy obviously you're going to eat all returners yeah the NICU pass out alcohol do that too without an alcohol increases your Gabba and did you drink enough they use on the pass up yeah and then you'll wake up feeling really energetic because the GABA receptors are down regulating the glutamate receptors up-regulate sir Oh alcohol is like the weirdest effects like alcohol affects it increases adrenaline it increases GABA increases all sorts of things oh yeah I can see why doctors recommend don't mix alcohol with a lot of these pharmaceuticals yeah virtually I just kind of like I said I kind of felt if I was depressive and kind of often um prone to like I don't know I guess that's why would I like kill myself I should probably stay away from alcohol just I know I just guess to kind of remove the tension the the temptation to use is kind of a medicine yeah the salt Medicaid you know one of the symptoms of hangover is decreased mood stability and increase anxiety mm-hmm so I don't like after like you know babe after drinking a lot the next day like in addition to the hangover system gonna have a hangover in addition t know the headache and kind of lack of energy and all that also I just boring like I just feel like eat a mooring system usual um it's also um it runs alcoholism runs in my family um fairly strongly so I'm okay someone's asking the special significance of calling people autistic these days okay what it is is just a lot of the people in kind of our community have very little social interaction and dumb and bad social skills and they kind of superficially demonstrate a kind of lot of characteristics of autism and ah yucky I don't know I see people who are not on the all right throw around the word autism like it's uh just just like it's filler word it's almost why members there's like the actual disorder of autism which is really you know my children of severe like communication disorders and who display repetitive behaviors and also you know social defects and then there's the kind of look extended use of autism just basically means you're kind of weird if you know it's like if you say that you're like poker chest people like oh yup there we go sperg well like you can like that kind of computer science stereotype like there is also like a particular kind of accent and kind of manner of speaking autistic people always have but my kind of joke is um if someone's edgy I say they're on the spectrum um and it's just kind of a double entendre people are all autistic um I used to call a special autism but now I don't think that's really the case I'm not really seeing much more autism from edge Lords I mean it I'm sure it exists but I don't know I see kind of sort of disconnected autistic and I think it would a lot of good people too I kind of I find a fair amount of it like it really radical libertarians actually there might be a little bit more of a basis for some kind of Asperger's symptoms because libertarians are more likely to be like engineers enjoy chest poker think really systematically really disregard any sort of emotional valuations into decisions you know they really like I random shit like that um it's also just her anukul head the other issue is we have four chan and it's related offsprings it's kind of created this subculture of people who are autistic or identified that way it have kind of tried to turn it into like a Supremacy thing so that's kinda like the whole normies thing okay now there's a website called co and XO calm and and he thinks that if your skull is shaped in the way of a Neanderthal that that you're more likely to have you know autistic kinds of symptoms or whatever and that the inner thaal's in the past probably had on cues of anywhere from 1,000 to 2,500 or something they've been selectively bred out by the melon heads well if you if you want to check it here I'm just gonna like my just just on the note of autism I wanted to point out that oh oh my god and he talked about the supremacy it's like yeah the Neanderthal autistic master race kind of thing I it's just too much okay guys um here is a link to the second facebook page i manage manage the death to normies party arm which is obviously a joke i'm not advocating violence but it's it's just um it's just like a joke like I I'd let me see i did a video on it to where I came up with like 1488 realm for autists it's like less the beauty of the Cody least the beauty of ponies in 2d life use foos vanish from the interwebs arm but no its you know there's kind of like this um this um autistics of privacy thing I find like a lot of people come on the alt writer like oh I'm autistic and that kind of thing I so I'll be like that depends if I kind of int j ryan the clustering of people on you all right and all that and then that's also associated that's being introverted it's good just being introverted and being really heavy just just not I'm being like way I feel like you know there are kind of zeroing in on a certain kind of personality archetype and it's kind of a joke they call them autistic because I think there is a link like if you took on hitting engineers like it's autistic people are more likely to be related to engineers really axle so like but axle ends or near and stuff your success or engineer you probably don't have autism but like the kind of cluster together there is like a link between you two but they're not actually talking about axes are talking about a certain personality type that's a soldier yeah they're talking about just kinds of behavioral and personality traits were as autism that's more of a pathology of emotional development and inability to have like theory of mind and stuff like that does some people just like just don't like being around other people and it's not really because of any kind of autistic thing no I could just be gentle misanthropy and that can be caused by already be like um really introverted and they just don't need that much social interaction well it's not needing it and just liking and those are two different things mm-hmm I got a lot of yeah and the happiness hypothesis again there was research that showed that occasional social interaction does increase happiness and life satisfaction in introverts it don't typically seek it out but it tends to be good for them mm-hmm I'll mention small bug seems that the mannerisms of an artist yes um I think there is some truth to libertarianism being kind of an odd autistic thing because it's basically entirely like theoretical and it's just entirely mathematical theoretical and it often displays kind of a complete lack of understanding of how people in the real world behave and this is why they're called like r androids and stuff like that and they gravitate so intensely toward economic descriptions of societal matters even though econ is just one component of it yeah I exactly and they're so quick to say galloped arts don't know shit about economics which they're usually right but in a not just wait what with the gala tard I said liba towards all lib cards yeah or at least I try to say they're tards oh you mean like liberals or yeah mm-hmm all the carrion ism but but of course well you love Rotarians they believe in Austrian economics which is retarded but maybe we should Oh we'll do a podcast of economics at some point if we have enough people who kind of like understand it I I have like a very shallow understanding of it um I I guess I kind of more understanding from like a political economic perspective I understood it enough to off talk on a podcast I think yeah took AP economics in high school yeah I took economics in high school too so I accepted both micro and macro my senior year I did Berloni exams mm-hmm okay um are we wrapping this chat up yep I was wow you read my mind oh yeah affected the source of use see I'm not autistic ya know I just um I was trying to but gradually right door or you just got into that rhythm and figured out that we were approaching one and a half hours to say hey you one and a half hours time in it for concern uh well that's when I try to keep them through that life because I just don't want to do sorry MW but your your for our like this five hour podcast I just can't watch them now I said what I at least briefly go over not just the mental illness aspect but at least go back over potential health remedies for cable with certain mental issues come okay I metal canopy your closing statement I guess are you closing little thing like we're not in a rasher just like wrapping it up go ahead yeah and kind of tying it back with Millennials I I'm actually fairly optimistic about the health prospects for Millennials cuz there's a lot more research into lifestyle intervention and drug remedies for it such as regular exercise and the effects that it has ombre morphology effects that antidepressants or other kinds of drugs have on brain morphology and then it seems like more millennial are interested in stuff like mindfulness meditation adopting that is you know just a staple part of your life and all these things slowly but surely kind of add up to opportunities where it can have a little bit more self direction in your life but also self structure your life and not succumbing to boredom and ennui and stuff like that mm-hmm okay so dubby would you like that I don't know kind of make a concluding statement okay I'll just start off by saying a mental illness is real don't believe the reetar to tell you that it's all it's all about the con by the government to make people passive like there's been very very good science on this using animal studies and then then using human studies and they've sold clear like biological markers for the poor depressed and other disorders player genetic studies like even even with the treatments they've clearly shown how different medications are treat depression and its own real benefits and treating depression so don't like like exactly don't pretend that none of this exists which it's real science is there like don't be an idiot about that and just I I do think a lot of people um I do think a lot of its overdiagnosed even I think that is a problem and I do think and this might be a conspiracy theory but i think a lot of it is that that public schools aren't really aren't really geared for like boys and a lot of boys just don't really do that well especially when they're younger and they just kind of medicate them to shut them up there when i was over to me though we're not talking about EVD in this uh all right okay the hottest but um i'll talk about the press like something like exactly what you were saying earlier you need to have norms like this is good behavior like having being happy and having friends and having a social life or and achieving goals and working towards something greater these are good things like you know just you know sitting in your room all day and laying in bed and why two shows on Netflix that's not a good way to live you have to be normative about that and if you're depressed like consider seeking any ER you're an atheist and you depressed like just consider that the atheist hump may be contributing to it if you could find a way to you know reach out to god it'll reach out to hire meeting and even just to start this to see what church is like and to see what they're just have an open mind toward three limbs in that might be very much in your best interest and yeah or if you don't you know there's there's also there's their secular philosophical outlets you don't have to get a legend like I don't have religious bone in my body and I know my father doesn't so it so that that might be hereditary bud come about mm-hmm but kind of a yes spiritual self development you can do that with or without without theism herb kind of a theological belief not saying that theological beliefs on help is just there's many ways it could dice of this and about mental illness in these kind of frames political movements I think if you look at people are all right or even radical feminist or communists you're going to see you never see a lot of depression probably because the world they want the world to be something that isn't the world of it is probably never going to UM model their visit of the world and that could obviously you know lead to a real sense of discontentment and all and all that and so that was random hexamer separately a link there but double don't like don't let people psychologizing you don't people don't let people say they don't worry reason you think this way is because you have meant to all this they have to argue if arguments like I have to say your your belief is wrong because x y&z not your belief is wrong because of mental illness but you could be depressed and you could still have the right political views but but but there is something to having a very bleak more view in a very bleak outlook towards civilization will reinforce the pro and will make you less right to like really thick towels saying that the divorce rate is fifty percent that's patently false it's a devil yes oh it make make towel is something to do some other time but I that whole thing I think is is more than double study of her ideology it's very nihilistic in Miss Ann topic yeah uh-huh so definitely keep in mind the mental illness aspect of Britain's political beliefs and beliefs that make you really disenchanted with society but don't let people you know psychologizing Nordic always abuse yeah I think if you just are kind of real and honest with yourself odd that really helps yeah I think you just have to go Russell reflection do I believe this because I think this is true and moral or do I believe this because um it's just kind of an outlet for some of like the other bullshit of my life yeah I could yeah like a doom and gloom kind of beliefs can be emotionally gratifying in a sense I just the last thing I'll say is if you think you may be depressed seek professional help you only have one chance at life and there's no reason to squander it when when you're in a depressed state you are not getting the most out of life you're you're basically wasting it's like it's like you pay to move it's like you paid money to go see a movie instead actually watching the movie you're just stop playing on your phone or something i doing something you don't really enjoy and when you have you watching like a really enjoyable movie so seek help if you think you depressed there's no she dresses no stay there's no stigma also miss you're driving your car with the ebrake locked you're not going to go spark also make sure that you get a doctor who you trust and who you can talk to and you have a good relationship with that's um that's really important and and don't just be a passive by standard read up on stuff read up on medications read up a kind of your disorder I've had kind of like intelligent conversations with my doctor her bipolar meds I'm like look I looked it up but I think this one would work better and this is why why why and that he said okay well you can try that one because that's on the list of medications i give out and you think that would be work better for you we'll just give it a try and so you really want to have a good relationship with your doctor and that can be hired to find but you can't be a passive party in these things um so I think that wraps it up so as always I thank you you dubbing and thank you is not good for coming on it's nice to have two people who are trade me kind of biology arm they're kind of flesh out some of the more scientific aspects of it um and I just like to thank everybody have a happy easter and i wish you good night

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